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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 22675 Location: NEW JOISEY
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 22675 Location: NEW JOISEY
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W.B. Fishbowl
Age: 57 Joined: 02 Oct 2014 Posts: 2423 Location: New York, New York, USA
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Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2022 12:23 am Post subject: |
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They did a little bit o' futzing. Should have been '15 Fifth Ave Jackson Hts.' |
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 22675 Location: NEW JOISEY
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Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2022 12:29 am Post subject: |
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W.B. Fishbowl wrote: |
They did a little bit o' futzing. Should have been '15 Fifth Ave Jackson Hts.' |
W.B.: I THOUGHT something was a bit "amiss", but, not being the rollsign expert that you are, I could not be sure.
Still, what a wonderfully refreshing sight.....a BUS that actually LOOKS like a bus!!
(I must admit, I've long been devoted to "batwing" buses, especially those that ran in "Noo Yawk")......
["15-Fifth Ave-Jackson Heights"] |
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W.B. Fishbowl
Age: 57 Joined: 02 Oct 2014 Posts: 2423 Location: New York, New York, USA
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Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2022 12:31 am Post subject: |
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Taken between 1957 and 1959; the route was '5 Sixth Ave' of the NYCO Division, which in March 1957 was shifted on SB routes to Seventh Avenue between 59th Street and Times Square, and then Broadway up to 34th Street. After a further rerouting along lower Manhattan streets in mid-1962 (traveling along West Broadway between Lispenard and Vesey Streets), this #5 was finally discontinued on Nov. 10, 1963 and merged with the #6 route which uptown path was moved all the way along Sixth. (Ironic that FACCo's #5 began its own incursion into Sixth starting that same day, after being extended to Houston Street and West Broadway/La Guardia Place; initially traveling on that avenue between there and West 8th Street when it turned onto Fifth, then on Jan. 14, 1966 extended to most of the rest of Sixth between Houston and 57th Streets - that same day that ex-NYCO #1 was moved one block west to Fifth on SB runs between 135th and 40th Streets, four years after FACCO #1 was discontinued upon The Strike.)
As for #2742, it was one of 45 buses (2737-2781) built in March 1949, originally flagged as 'NEW YORK CITY OMNIBUS CORPORATION'. Changed, no doubt, to FACL after June 1, 1956. |
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 22675 Location: NEW JOISEY
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W.B. Fishbowl
Age: 57 Joined: 02 Oct 2014 Posts: 2423 Location: New York, New York, USA
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Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2022 12:38 am Post subject: |
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 wrote: | And, of course, SURFACE also operated this type (#3020-#3059)
(too bad the "Tee-Yay" never ordered any of these) |
1) Those 40 ST buses were the penultimate TDH-5106's ever built - the last 50 for FACL (2645-2694) were the very last of those hardy perennials ever built, before production began on the first-gen Fishbowls.
2) The 'Tee-Yay' did order Old Looks of that type - just without the protruding front sign boxes. The 9000 series (which "went to die" in Staten Island, as touched on elsewhere before) was produced somewhere in-between the FACL 2605-2644 order and the twin ST and FACL sets above.
Here's the tale of the tape:
1430-1469 - Fifth Avenue Coach Lines (New York City NY) 2605-2644 08/58
1470-1568 5 New York City Transit Authority (New York City NY) 9022-9120 08-09/58
1569-1590 - New York City Transit Authority (New York City NY) 9000-9021 08-09/58
- - -
1638-1677 - Surface Transit Inc (New York City NY) 3020-3059 07/59
1678-1727 - Fifth Avenue Coach Lines (New York City NY) 2645-2694 07/59 |
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 22675 Location: NEW JOISEY
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Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2022 12:42 am Post subject: |
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W.B.:
As always, greatly appreciate your in-depth info.
Still irks the heck out of me that NOT ONE of these distinctive buses were spared the torch......
"NYO"
["Ride The Surface Way"] |
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W.B. Fishbowl
Age: 57 Joined: 02 Oct 2014 Posts: 2423 Location: New York, New York, USA
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Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2022 12:45 am Post subject: |
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This is why I think, had FACL and ST carried on past '62, they would have likely ordered 'Dangerfields' for lesser routes in Queens (FACCo #16 Elmhurst Crosstown) and 'da Bronx' (for Surface routes).
Alas, there is a warning notice about that link not being a secure site. But I think some of those pics wound up on the nycsubway.org photo database anyway. |
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 22675 Location: NEW JOISEY
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Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2022 12:57 am Post subject: |
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W.B.:
I got that same "warning", but that was when I realized that I had entered the incorrect url; after that, I did not get it again.
It would make sense, as you said, had FACL and SURFACE survived, they would have likewly purchased "Dangerfields" for the areas you mentioned.
Perhaps it's me, but, somehow, I always thought that a "Dangerfield"looked most at home in "Da Bronx"......
"NYO" |
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W.B. Fishbowl
Age: 57 Joined: 02 Oct 2014 Posts: 2423 Location: New York, New York, USA
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Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2022 1:09 am Post subject: |
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There is also, now, on eBay, an auction for a Hagstrom bus map misdated 1950's but clearly from 1963 (I have advised the seller about this and am awaiting word), as MaBSTOA is already mentioned:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/224941564094
It was before:
- The banning of all buses from Washington Square, in September 1963 (in those last months were the first where Fishbowls made for MaBSTOA first began showing up)
- #5 Fifth Avenue-Riverside Drive being extended to Houston Street and West Broadway (eff. 11/10/63), and the 3/1/64 extensions of #1 Fourth and Madison Avenues to South Ferry and #7 Broadway-Columbus-Lenox to 14th Street-Union Square
- #5 Sixth Avenue being discontinued, and #6 reconstituted as "Broadway-Seventh Avenue-Avenue of the Americas"
- M-103 59th Street being extended to 73rd Street and Broadway
They mentioned two routes supposedly discontinued for perpetually low ridership, which had been run on 'once-a-day' franchise holder status since the '50's: #22 Pitt and Ridge Streets, and M-105 Tenth Avenue. Too, there was a "new route," M-107, which despite its Surface numbering (recycled from a very short-lived early 1940's 180th-181st Street Crosstown route) was in fact administered under the NYCO Division and ran across 106th Street to Fifth Avenue and, until 1964, 110th Street to Riverside Drive. |
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 22675 Location: NEW JOISEY
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 22675 Location: NEW JOISEY
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 22675 Location: NEW JOISEY
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
Joined: 18 Dec 2007 Posts: 22675 Location: NEW JOISEY
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Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2022 3:41 pm Post subject: |
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"The 'Dangerfield' Report".....
We've all collectively agreed that the Flex New Look (aka "Dangerfields") was indeed a bus that never truly got its share of the spotlight.
Think of it; the GM Fishbowl, in 1959/1960 debuted to nationwide fanfare and gala celebrations around the country.
However, several years later, when the fist Flex New Looks arrived, for the most part, there was little or no fanfare.
Basically, it was, simply, "just another new bus".
Too, the GM Fishbowl was indeed an original design from the ground up; the "Dangerfield", on the other hand, was but a bus INSPIRED by the GM-built buses.
Even their windshields were but larger versions of those used on postwar TWIN COACH products.
Too, look at the "Tee-Yay" and MaBSTOA bus photo galleries at nycsubway.org; there are far more photos of GM Fishbowls in these galleries than of "Dangerfields".
Appearance, wise, it's the forward-slanting side windows that most closely relate the Flex buses to the Fishbowls; even thier overall design is of a more "hefty" look, compared to the more "svelte" design of the Fishbowls.
No matter; many older bus enthusiasts will agree, I'm sure, that the "Dangerfields" were buses that were attractive, solidly-built, and reliable.
Forever living in the shadow of the more-touted, more-numerous General Motors Fishbowls, the "Dangerfields" could not help but to be an "underdog";, but, this, I feel, has made these now-classic buses all the more endearing.....
"NYO"
["Flex New Look: The Rodney Dangerfield" of the bus world"] |
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